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donteatpoop
11-04-2007, 02:23 PM
I bought a few books to get me through the next two months or so, but when I'm done with them, I'm going to need a new book. That's where you come in; recommend a book. Preferably a good one. Tell me why it's worth reading and a brief synopsis.

I'll recommend one for all of you first; that way you don't have to be all nervous at being the first one to do so in this thread.

A Game of Thrones by George R. R. Martin

This is the first book in Martin's "A Song of Ice and Fire" series. It is possibly the greatest fantasy series of all time*. The characters are all fully developed and the world that this series takes place on is rich and full of life. The great thing about this series is that you're never quite sure who is and who is not a "good guy"; which reflects life, really. People are people, after all; sometimes they do good and sometimes they do bad.

The fantasy setting is somewhat different than what most of us are used to reading; there is little magic and the presence of mythical creatures is a rarity. This is the way I like it, though; it allows for more tension and more character development without maintaining a constant focus on how magical everything is. In his series, Martin proves that you don't need such writing crutches as magic and monsters to create a rich fantasy world.

(thoughts by anyone else who has read this?)

*according to donteatpoop

apotheosis
11-04-2007, 03:03 PM
Hyperion by Dan Simmons.


It's a great sci-fi book and has several smaller interrelated stories within it. Very enjoyable read, the futuristic universe Simmons creates is inventive, fascinating, well thought out and not that terribly far-fetched.

ChubbyTeletubby
11-04-2007, 03:21 PM
The Kite Runner, by Khaled Hosseini

Provides the reader with some fairly in-depth insights into the rich history of Afghanistan, without being overbearing.

The story develops a little TOO nicely - all the pieces seem to fit together much too precisely. It seems engineered at times.

However, that being said, I finished the book in two days. My dad, who has been to Afghanistan, related many similar tales. Afghanistan is a fascinating place. This is not the land of Al Qaeda, nor the Taliban. It is a tribal land belonging to a strong and independent people who fall victim to the whims of larger, external powers.

Leblanc4prez
11-04-2007, 04:10 PM
Papilion - Henri Cheri

The classic satory of an innocent man's struggle for freedom. The thing I most admire is that he never gave in. True story.

Animal Farm - George Orwell

If you haven't read this book, do your self a favor, go to the library and borrow it out... Now!
A classic story about power and the pressures caused by corrupt leaders. About as long as candidea and just as socialy important in my opinion.

Vesnic
11-04-2007, 04:46 PM
The Velveteen Rabbit--makes me cry every fucking time. Life and death and friendship, oh my!

(I agree on Papillon. Not that I ever read the book. But Steve McQueen sure was a toasty muffin back before he died too young of cancer.)

Usoki
11-04-2007, 07:34 PM
Hyperion by Dan Simmons.


It's a great sci-fi book and has several smaller interrelated stories within it. Very enjoyable read, the futuristic universe Simmons creates is inventive, fascinating, well thought out and not that terribly far-fetched.

Is that the guy who wrote Endymion? I've seen it on the shelves, but I've been a bit paranoid about picking it up. I have issues with reading series that go on forever- I want to know that a work has an actual conclusion before I pick it up. I have a few series I started reading before I made that personal self goal...but, other than that, I refuse to read something unless it's finished.

So...DEP, is that series finished? I could really use a fantasy series that doesn't go on for 10+ novels with no end in sight. *cough* Wheel of Time *cough*

That being said, David Drake's Lord of the Isles series is two novels away from completion, and totally awesome. It's the first fantasy I've read that actually balances magic. Not only that, they attempt to balance the "Unlikely heroes who shape the entire world" by involving epic military battles. It's ridiculoulsly predictable at times, but it's still well written. I approve.

donteatpoop
11-04-2007, 09:27 PM
Is that the guy who wrote Endymion? I've seen it on the shelves, but I've been a bit paranoid about picking it up. I have issues with reading series that go on forever- I want to know that a work has an actual conclusion before I pick it up. I have a few series I started reading before I made that personal self goal...but, other than that, I refuse to read something unless it's finished.

So...DEP, is that series finished? I could really use a fantasy series that doesn't go on for 10+ novels with no end in sight. *cough* Wheel of Time *cough*

That being said, David Drake's Lord of the Isles series is two novels away from completion, and totally awesome. It's the first fantasy I've read that actually balances magic. Not only that, they attempt to balance the "Unlikely heroes who shape the entire world" by involving epic military battles. It's ridiculoulsly predictable at times, but it's still well written. I approve.


*sigh*

It's four books into it. Not quite finished yet. Don't know how long he's doing it, but every novel has an ending... just a sense of more to come.

It's Much better than Wheel of Time (which I couldn't seem to ever get into, and I'm glad of that now).

kakunoshin
11-07-2007, 06:51 PM
Good Omens - Terry Pratchet and Neil Gaiman

Its apocalypse time but someone has misplaced the 10 year old anti-christ. Left to his own devices, he seeks to remake the world in his own image.

Leblanc4prez
11-07-2007, 06:58 PM
Any of the Discworld Books. They all rock.. I like the ones about Death best.

donteatpoop
11-07-2007, 07:01 PM
Good Omens - Terry Pratchet and Neil Gaiman

Its apocalypse time but someone has misplaced the 10 year old anti-christ. Left to his own devices, he seeks to remake the world in his own image.

I simply could not get into that book. I love Gaiman, but hate Pratchet; so I wasn't sure what I would think of it. All in all I think it tried too hard. I gave the book to a neighbor and he fucking loved it, he'd always try to talk to me about how great it was but I'd tell him "Dude, I only read three chapters before I got sick of it and gave it to you."

If you've never read anything else from Gaiman, you owe it to yourself to seek him out. He's a wonderfully quirky writer and one of my favorites.

Vesnic
11-07-2007, 07:12 PM
In honor of the overwhelmingly homo-happy environment today, I will go ahead and recommend W.S. Burroughs' Cities of the Red Night. It's the first part of an "apocalyptic" trilogy he wrote at the end of his life. As you'd expect with Burroughs, there's tons of hot gay death hanging action and secret gay conspiracies smelling of ozone and opium. A great little book to accidentally leave sitting around at an evangelical church or a kindergarten classroom.

Leblanc4prez
11-07-2007, 07:17 PM
Shippo: The Very Hungry Catepillar. (I wish Geroge Bush would return the copy I lent him)

Vesnic
11-07-2007, 07:21 PM
No, he's still busy looking up the definitions to all those challenging words, forgetting what he just learned, looking up the words again, forgetting them again, looking up all those durned fancy words...

You just need to buy yourself a new copy methinks.

Leblanc4prez
11-07-2007, 07:25 PM
Shippo: I am very sad now...

Psy: I recomend the art of war by Tzhang Tzun. (or how ever you spell his gay asian name)

Hi! My name is: Katie
01-27-2008, 08:26 AM
The Diary of Chester the Killer (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080126/ap_on_re_us/american_tragedy_diary;_ylt=AjCnm4j__qsCSRXfpJvcaq RREhkF)

I came across this article yesterday at work. It completely fascinated me. For those that choose not to read the article here's the gist:

Guy gets girlfriend knocked up.
She wants to get married.
He doesn't
Guy kills girlfriend on boating trip.
Guy arrested and tried.
Guy sentenced to death.
Guy falsely believes he will be released.
Guy keeps a journal detailing his thoughts... only once mentioning the girlfriend he murdered...
Guy slowly comes to grips with his impending doom.

Looks like it will be an interesting read. He was a well read chap, and it includes quotes by numerous philosophers and poets. He might have fit in here, minus the whole murder thing.

~Katie

End Master
01-27-2008, 08:31 AM
Looks like it will be an interesting read. He was a well read chap, and it includes quotes by numerous philosophers and poets. He might have fit in here, minus the whole murder thing.

~Katie

I would argue that the murder thing and fitting in here aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

End Master
01-27-2008, 09:31 AM
Your title changes when you post more.

Since we're on the subject. I was lurking on a few other forums awhile back where they were slamming mostly a bunch of fantasy, horror and scifi writers.

So as "proper writers" on this site do you feel that the following famous writers (or series) really suck, or were those people just trying to look cool by hating what's considered popular?

Here are a few examples of those mentioned:

The Wheel of Time series (Said it just sucked more as it went along)

The Sword of Shannara series (Said it was just LOTR, but poorly written)

The Xanth series (Piers Anthony was pretty much hated and considered a big pedo since he apparently puts in a lot of underage sex in his stories)

ANYTHING involving the Forgotten Realms (R.A. Salvatore writing about some emo dark elf or Ed Greenwood writing about hims…er I mean Elminster)

David Eddings (Only good for little kids and just repeats himself)

J K Rowling & Harry Potter (Pretty much the same remarks made about David)

L Ron Hubbard (Badly written Scientology propaganda)

Ann Rice (Nothing but a bunch of whiny emo vamps)

Terry Goodkind (Overrated, flat characters, clumsily written)

Robert Heinlein (Male leads are considered annoying and preachy)

Ayn Rand (Considered racist and the philosophy is only embraced by idiotic pseudo-intellectual college kids)

H.P. Lovecraft (Created a better “mythos” rather than actually writing them and sucked at writing dialogue)

Christopher Paolini (Eragon just “ripped off” Star Wars)

Stephen King (I think someone just said he was horrible and that was about it)

thoric
01-27-2008, 10:19 AM
I have always liked Eddings. Belgariad was the first series I read and his books aren't as juvenile as people claim. As for the repetition, don't all fantasy writers repeat themselves?

The Belisarius series by Eric Flint and David Drake is good. And entertaining. Notice I say entertaining, not literary masterpiece. It has many flaws but it's a good read nonetheless.

I am also a fan of David Gemmell. He is what could be called, a prolific writer.

As for GRRM, I started reading the first book from SoIaF. Very engrossing. All greys, hardly any black and white. Arguably the best fantasy series ever.

Oh and I couldn't complete the first book of the Shannara series. It was like a more boring version of LotR. And I used to think LotR was the most yawn inducing.

Raymond E. Feist isn't all that bad either. Im still reading Magician: Apprentice though.

donteatpoop
01-27-2008, 11:27 AM
Your title changes when you post more.

Since we're on the subject. I was lurking on a few other forums awhile back where they were slamming mostly a bunch of fantasy, horror and scifi writers.

So as "proper writers" on this site do you feel that the following famous writers (or series) really suck, or were those people just trying to look cool by hating what's considered popular?

Here are a few examples of those mentioned:

The Wheel of Time series
I have tried several times to get into this series, but the first few chapters bored me to death. Three times I got the book from the library, and three times I set it down with disappointment. I'd say it sucked from the get go. And I'm glad I never got into it considering that Jordan has died without finishing.

The Xanth series (Piers Anthony was pretty much hated and considered a big pedo since he apparently puts in a lot of underage sex in his stories)
They were fun to read when I was just getting into reading; especially because he has a knack for describing boobs. Not exactly amazing work, but entertaining for young adults.

ANYTHING involving the Forgotten Realms (R.A. Salvatore writing about some emo dark elf or Ed Greenwood writing about hims…er I mean Elminster)
I liked Salvatore's first trilogy in Forgotten Realms, liked the trilogy about the dark elf's origins; but he never seemed to figure out when to put the character down and give up on it.

David Eddings (Only good for little kids and just repeats himself)
This one disappointed the shit out of me. I heard great things about it, and foud it entertaining to read; but it's all so happy-fucking-go-lucky that it disturbed me. And it's definately written for the young-ins. Everything about this series was cliche.

J K Rowling & Harry Potter
I'm glad they made movies out of these, because the stories are great but the writing is terrible.

L Ron Hubbard (Badly written Scientology propaganda)
Terrible terrible terrible sci-fi. I hear he's great at creating religeons, though.

Ann Rice (Nothing but a bunch of whiny emo vamps)
She'd be a great writer if she didn't forget about the story she is telling in the middle of describing something. Her mind seems to just wander off and take three chapters to get through before returning to the actual story.


Stephen King (I think someone just said he was horrible and that was about it)
I have a love/hate relationship with his writings. He is capable of such genius (Hearts in Atlantis & The Gunslinger, for example) but usually takes shortcuts and puts out garbage (Dreamcatcher & Desperation, for example). He sometimes loses focus on the story in creating uneccessary background information on his characters (if you've read Dreamcatcher, you may recall the half a chapter flashback to one of the protagonists breaking into a neighbors house and walking around with a boner - WTF??). He has potential, but usually shortchanges the reader.

End Master
01-27-2008, 11:55 AM
one of the protagonists breaking into a neighbors house and walking around with a boner - WTF??).

That bit sounds like something Chubby or I would've written in a room of a story on here. Hell it sounds like something Chubby's probably done in real life.

I cheated with the Dark Elf thing since I read the graphic novel versions of them. But oddly even in this condensed form, the same thing happened. The first trilogy was cool and then it got a little less interesting after he finally left the underdark.

Vesnic
01-27-2008, 11:58 AM
But oddly even

Wow, that blows my mind.

I'm not big into this genre, but I have to say I did get a kick out of Rice's stuff, though I've hardly read all of it, or even most of it. It was sumptuous and thrilling and that's what I was looking for when I picked up Interview.

apotheosis
01-27-2008, 01:40 PM
Of People and Panda's is an intelligent design textbook. Good for a few laughs.

Locke
01-27-2008, 02:35 PM
I read the Shannara series when I was younger, and really liked it. When Terry Brooks added new stories to the series more recently, I picked up a couple. I could still read it to get through a plane trip or something, but now that I'm older I realize the writing really isn't that great.

I found Harry Potter entertaining and well-written. The language wasn't brilliant or anything, but the story was fresh and well-told, though it became somewhat less so in the later books.

Heinlein can be hit or miss. I probably liked The Moon is a Harsh Mistress best of what I've read, though I've only taken in a few of his novels. The male lead came across as believable and interesting. For Us, the Living, on the other hand, was pretty preachy. It had little in the way of plot; most of the novel was absorbed in discussions between the characters that served to flesh out Heinlein's idea of a utopian society. That's fine, if it's what you're looking to read; I wasn't.

From what I saw in Atlas Shrugged when I read it back in high school, Ayn Rand writes well for the most part. She's so enamored of her philosophy, though, and so bitterly opposed to certain aspects of society that the book tends to get off track and focus single-mindedly on her message. It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't so very bitter and a bit repetitive. It doesn't help that I disagree with the author's philosophy, and I did skip part of the novel that involves a sixty-something page monologue speech by one of the main characters. If you can stomach the message, the bitterness behind it, and the tangents the book sometimes takes to support it, there is a real and decent story.

Stephen King is definitely hit-or-miss, and that's if you like his style. His stories always tend to "flow" very well; he keeps the pages turning even when, as DEP says, his stories sometimes lose focus. Some of his work is genuinely good; some of it is well-written page to page but not worth reading overall. I was disappointed with much of his Dark Tower writing that followed The Wastelands. His obsession with using the series to tie together all his writing, extending even to including himself as a major part of the plot, didn't help. Probably more often than not, Stephen King writes the literary equivalent of empty calories. It's entertaining, but it doesn't really say anything, and if you don't just have time to burn reading it on a trip or something, it can be quite disappointing. As DEP points out, though, you do come across the occasional diamond in the rough.

ChubbyTeletubby
01-28-2008, 06:03 AM
The Wheel of Time. This series came highly recommended to me by a friend years and years ago. However I couldn't get into it. I forget why.

The Sword of Shannara series was horrible. I read a couple of the books, but it was definitely not as convincing a world as Tolkien's stuff. I actually like Tolkien's long and drawn out style

I just picked up Fellowship of the Ring again. While it is true that most of the book is written in an overly verbose "They went from point A to point B and saw some stuff" style, I find that I actually LIKE it.

The first few chapters are especially delightful. Lots of ale quaffing and pipe-weed smoking.

A Fox passing through the woods on business of his own stopped several minutes and sniffed.

'Hobbits' he thought. 'Well? What next? I have heard of strange doing in this land, but I have seldom heard of a hobbit sleeping out of doors under a tree. Three of them! There's something mighty queer behind this.' He was quite right, but he never found out any more about it.

Piers Anthony is a total pedo. A lot of his stuff is just plain weird. He's creative, but disturbed. I quit reading his drivel when I encountered the child porn stuff. I can tolerate almost anything but that. Even I have lines that I do not cross.

Forgotten Realms. There's a reason they're forgotten. HORRIBLE.

J K Rowling & Harry Potter. Too mainstream. Too trendy. Never bothered with the movies really OR the books. Not my style. Mildly entertaining to watch.

L Ron Hubbard is a moron.

H.P. Lovecraff. I only ever read a couple of his stories and I'd say he's stuff reminds me of Tolkien's Simalrillion . Heavy stuff, bogs you down, but still interesting.

Stephen King is creative. Good writer. Over rated, though. I heard his new one is a worthy read.

apotheosis
01-28-2008, 10:33 AM
The Wheel of Time. This series came highly recommended to me by a friend years and years ago. However I couldn't get into it. I forget why.

The Sword of Shannara series was horrible. I read a couple of the books, but it was definitely not as convincing a world as Tolkien's stuff. I actually like Tolkien's long and drawn out style

I just picked up Fellowship of the Ring again. While it is true that most of the book is written in an overly verbose "They went from point A to point B and saw some stuff" style, I find that I actually LIKE it.

The first few chapters are especially delightful. Lots of ale quaffing and pipe-weed smoking.

A Fox passing through the woods on business of his own stopped several minutes and sniffed.

'Hobbits' he thought. 'Well? What next? I have heard of strange doing in this land, but I have seldom heard of a hobbit sleeping out of doors under a tree. Three of them! There's something mighty queer behind this.' He was quite right, but he never found out any more about it.

Piers Anthony is a total pedo. A lot of his stuff is just plain weird. He's creative, but disturbed. I quit reading his drivel when I encountered the child porn stuff. I can tolerate almost anything but that. Even I have lines that I do not cross.

Forgotten Realms. There's a reason they're forgotten. HORRIBLE.

J K Rowling & Harry Potter. Too mainstream. Too trendy. Never bothered with the movies really OR the books. Not my style. Mildly entertaining to watch.

L Ron Hubbard is a moron.

H.P. Lovecraff. I only ever read a couple of his stories and I'd say he's stuff reminds me of Tolkien's Simalrillion . Heavy stuff, bogs you down, but still interesting.

Stephen King is creative. Good writer. Over rated, though. I heard his new one is a worthy read.

Chubby's words shall live on throughout eternity.

End Master
03-24-2008, 07:46 PM
Alright in the efforts to "stir up" intellectual writer related conversation that some have been talking about...

Has anyone here ever read anything by Harry Turtledove? He’s really well known for writing alternate history. (Byzantine Empire never falling/American South winning the civil war etc) The series that first caught my attention of him was his World War series which involved an alien invasion during WW2 and the follow up after the invasion.

The entire storyline stretches out over the course of 8 books. I found it pretty interesting.

Another series I liked was the "Phule series" which was by Robert Asprin. I got the last two books sitting on the shelf which I unfortunately still haven't gotten around to reading yet.

ChubbyTeletubby
03-24-2008, 08:24 PM
Alright in the efforts to "stir up" intellectual writer related conversation that some have been talking about...

Has anyone here ever read anything by Harry Turtledove? He’s really well known for writing alternate history. (Byzantine Empire never falling/American South winning the civil war etc) The series that first caught my attention of him was his World War series which involved an alien invasion during WW2 and the follow up after the invasion.

The entire storyline stretches out over the course of 8 books. I found it pretty interesting.

Another series I liked was the "Phule series" which was by Robert Asprin. I got the last two books sitting on the shelf which I unfortunately still haven't gotten around to reading yet.

As I recall I had a skinhead friend in high school who LOVED Turtledove's work. I never got around to reading it, though.

It does fascinate me sometimes. History is so fragile and untempered. The whole world in which we live is based on narrow victories and impossible defeats.

History has always fascinated me. So it's worth reading, eh? Hmmm. Might have to give it a shot!

Usoki
03-24-2008, 08:54 PM
I think I've read something by Asprin...it was a book from the Myth Adventure series, and I was drawn to it because of artistic contributions from Phil Foglio. But it was one of the worst things I've read in a while- predicable plot, and the book was literally poorly made- numerous typos, misspellings, and outright typesetting errors. I'm thinking it was a kids series, so I haven't bothered to look at anything else he's done.

Foglio's amazing, though, even if Girl Genius is a comic book series, not an actual novel.

End Master
03-24-2008, 09:10 PM
As I recall I had a skinhead friend in high school who LOVED Turtledove's work.

That’s hilarious he liked it, considering that Turtledove’s Jewish.

But given that Turtledove has written a few stories about the Third Reich not being defeated or a similar Confederate “Reich” rising after they lose a third civil war with the US (Which is basically that timeline’s WWI) I can sort of see a skinhead liking the stuff.

I've read some of Foglio's little comics when I used to buy and read Dragon magazine, he usually had some humorous stuff. Never read Girl Genius, but I've seen his artwork in other places. Haven't read Asprin's Myth series either.

End Master
03-28-2008, 09:56 PM
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewCulture.asp?Page=/Culture/archive/200803/CUL20080310a.html

Discuss.

Or just make gay jokes if you prefer, either way it'll entertain us for a little while!

ChubbyTeletubby
03-28-2008, 10:12 PM
I'm just glad kids are reading.

Who HASN'T wanted to get hurt in an anal manner? It's just natural. I don't see what all the fuss is about.

And when that condom breaks it's just like...fuck it. I mean, pulling out is fine...as long as you spill it in my mouth so it's the same diff, right?

In the end we're all going to die from SOMETHING. Why not AIDS? It's trendy.

Seriously though, what the fuck? I'm all for gay rights but this shit crosses the line. But what's new? It's just not even shocking anymore.

It really isn't. I don't freak out about it. If I had kids who were reading this shit I'd have faith enough in the way I raised them for them not to go out and get butt fucked right after their 'fragile' brains absorbed this porn.

Really, who cares? I mean, they're going to get exposed to this shit sooner or later. If parents would simply do their jobs and not leave it to the underpaid educators to raise them..

Kids are more savvy then we give them credit for.

It's whatever. I don't have kids, don't plan on having kids. But if I ever DID, I know what NOT to do at least.

This kind of shit is the LEAST of our concerns. Focus, America! FOCUS!

Leblanc4prez
03-29-2008, 01:04 AM
Books are nice... They are great fryed in oil.

Locke
03-31-2008, 03:29 PM
Regarding Angels in America (I've heard of it, though I haven't read more than the excerpts in the post End linked to), from what I've seen it might have as much literary value as one of those Chuck Palahniuk books, but I doubt it. From that standpoint, there are a vast number of what most would consider better and more relevant choices for required reading. Ethically, I believe the school overstepped its bounds.

The community has certain expectations of the education and values their kids will receive at school, and the teacher or department who gave the go-ahead to that book betrayed those in a big way. Yes, teach tolerance, though I'm not sure how much good it will do for an unreceptive high-schooler, and to the others it's redundant. Tolerance is nice, graphic sex in novels assigned at school can only contribute further to our culture's decline.



Referring back to the thread's title, I read a novel online recently I enjoyed. I'm into speculative fiction in a big way; it's a broad genre and so many more of the stories seem so creative. I usually like something with a hint of sci-fi; this story was a bit absurd and gratuitously violent for me, but interesting nonetheless. http://www.nightshadebooks.com/Downloads/GreyElectronicARC.pdf

I like some of Ted Chiang's stuff, too. He's a serious mathematician who's written seven or so short stories along the way, and some are quite well-written. All that aren't listed in the link can be found with a little searching. http://www.freesfonline.de/authors/Ted_Chiang.html

That site in general has a huge amount of speculative fiction available free if you're into it: http://www.freesfonline.de/index.html

End Master
04-03-2008, 09:03 PM
Hey Locke (or anyone else), here's an interesting site for speculative fiction/alternate history.

http://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/index.php

You can even add to some alternate earth scenarios in the Shared Worlds section, or just create a "What If" scenario in any of the other forums and expand on it from there.

wolfen44
03-23-2009, 03:56 AM
Any of the Discworld Books. They all rock.. I like the ones about Death best.

Ever Played the game it kicks ass

End Master
11-04-2011, 04:30 PM
So I recently read Walking Dead: Rise of the Governor.

I thought it was cool to see how the villain in the comic got started on his path to... well, villainy.

It might be only of interest for those that have read the Walking Dead comic, but someone can easily read it without knowing anything about the comic since it still works as a straight up stand alone horror themed book. You just get a few extra references if you've read the comic.

Vesnic
01-23-2012, 06:05 AM
I'm working for an insurance company in the KC Metro area.

Speaking of Kansas City, have any of you guys read a book by Thomas Frank (of Baffler fame) called What's the Matter with Kansas? The book is a few years old now, so of course it doesn't include the 2008 financial fuse-box explosion in its evaluations. However, like all political/historical books that age well, the 2008 meltdown makes perfect sense in the light of Frank's arguments.

Most importantly of all, he is a damn good writer, sharp and witty and sometimes villainously funny, yet simultaneously possessed of that Midwestern charm and modesty we've all come to admire so much in our dear Usoki. More successfully than others (though still not completely), this book attempts to answer the ubiquitous question, "What the fuck happened to America and why are people voting directly against their own interests?" Assuming I understood the book at all, the answer essentially boils down to, "This happens because all logical thinking and rational discourse have been excised in favor of populist appeals to emotion which gain their strength from an ingenious and self-propagating system of vociferous antagonism against absolutely everything."

Hmm, my version of the answer is pretty muddled...which is why you should read the book.

I feel as though I've also gotten a bit of a geography lesson about the little-known state of Dorothyland. I now know the difference between Kansas City, KS and Kansas City, MO, and I'm familiar with Johnson County and Mission Hills and names like Wyandotte and Garden City and Populism with a capital "P". I have to say Kansas sounds like an utterly insane yet periodically brilliant place where new religions are born and beliefs are held with the tenacity of bulldog-crab-letter-D's.

What's the Matter with Kansas? Mr. Frank won't mince words when he tells you. Highly, highly recommended.

donteatpoop
01-23-2012, 11:28 AM
I'm currently rereading American Gods. Apparently HBO is making a series out of it. Solid story, excellent blend of mythologies. It's done as only Neil Gaiman can do it.

Usoki
01-23-2012, 04:02 PM
That... does sound fairly interesting, actually. And not just because of the Kansas element- I love discussions on why people are so stupid.

...that Midwestern charm and modesty we've all come to admire so much in our dear Usoki.
Okay, yes... but you have to admit that over the years I've gotten better. (Worse?) I mean, granted, saying that I have less modesty is sorta like giving a toddler a knife and claiming that the kid is now much more dangerous... technically true, but not really worth saying.

I feel as though I've also gotten a bit of a geography lesson about the little-known state of Dorothyland.
The majority of Kansas City being in Missouri is just one of many absurd things about Kansas. One of our favorite things to do is to bastardize the pronunciation of words, and then ambush foreigners when they mess it up.

Olathe, Neodesha, Salina, El Dorado, Greenwich
o-LAY-thuh, Ne-O-deh-SHAY, sah-LIE-nuh, El-do-RAY-do, grEEn-which

So, anyway, the whole point of the thread...

I have to admit, I'm enjoying the works of Brandon Sanderson. I was worried, since he's been chosen to wrap up the legacy of one of the most verbose fantasy authors around. However, his own works seem to wrap up pretty nicely, and fairly quickly. He even has a few one-shot novels. My only complaint is that the guy has no understanding of 'trivial details'. Everything comes back later. It was ridiculous enough in Elantris... God only knows what will turn up when he has an entire trilogy to pull back from.