Puzzle Stories

[ChubbyTeletubby]

Okay, first of all...

I didn't read half of what was so well wordingly written in this thread.

Here's my spin:

*that's your cue to close your web browser and actually do something CONSTRUCTIVE with your life for once*

I LOVED VISUAL EPIC. Full of laughs. God (whom I think is a primitive construct of the human imagination/governing 'law' of the universe which is so far beyond our understanding it'd be like trying to explain 'Seinfeld' to a tick) I loved it.

Of course this site isn't geared towards projects like that. But those who choose to bring them to the table should be accepted, as long as it's well done. Stories can have pictures, pictures can have stories.

Everything is a game. Life is game. Hell, taking a piss is a game. I always miss that damn target.

But then again I'm a free love kinda guy. Whatever goes, goes. As long as no one gets hurt. Seriously hurt. Blood is okay in moderation.

But um. I like the site the way it is, with the code oriented toward STORIES.

However, if someone chooses to bend the code to their will, within the set parameters, to a 'game-like' story...well...more power to them.

Also, I like Blazin' Buffalo Ranch Doritos. Yay for socks!

Yours truly,

Chi to the Ti

[Ryan_DuBois]

Thanks, man!

[End Master]

Well as far as CYOA sites go, besides us there's really only one other "game" in town and that's CYS. They got variables and an advanced editor over there. They also have more "gamestories", though recently some of them have been putting a little more effort into the writing aspect.

http://www.chooseyourstory.com/

[Ryan_DuBois]

Could you guys give me some websties with a variable feature? Maybe I'll try to finish my story on there, just for the hell of it.

[xnull]

It may be possible to do some workaround. Actually, if I were to develop something on a server anywhere (like a free hosting site) that kept track of variables and a session, you could just have one room that had 5 images which constantly loops on itself. The server could provide different images based on the history of choices provided to the user. I could even have this system use a special image to have a back link.

Design is like this...

SERVER A (infinite-story.com) offers only BBCode -> HTML with a limited range of options. This is an intelligent design because of security considerations.

SERVER B (any host at all) offers an application with simple variable switches.

SERVER A hosts a page with 1 image. The image makes a request to SERVER B for mainimage.php or something like that. Any CGI. The script takes your current session into consideration and sends back the image for the current room or situation. Each choice from this room is an image instead of typical text hyperlink. These images are pictures of text created by GD or some other image library created in real time on SERVER B given the current room or situation. They can be generated to look like hyperlinks.

When a user of SERVER A clicks on one of the options presented, they are taken to SERVER B. SERVER B knows which option was selected and keeps track of it in the current session. Something like http://SERVER B/option.php?choice=1 should be the href of these image links. There can also be a back button which will wipe out the last choice. The HTTP headers of SERVER B simply redirect to the referrer. The user will be brought back to the SERVER A page and will be presented with the new room and situations (even though it is identically the same HTML page).

The assumptions to this workaround are the following:
Someone has enough time to make these scripts.
Reliable and cheap (preferably free) hosting can be found.
Users have cookies enabled (shouldn't really be a problem).
Users have referrers enabled (shouldn't really be a problem).
The hoster allows enough space and bandwidth for this application.

The only problems as I see it right now is that with this design the story on I-S only has one room. Sure they can pad their rooms as much as they would like....
In addition the application isn't really I-S. If SERVER B is taken down the story on SERVER A will not work.
In addition because choices will be delivered as images, wraparound on the text won't very nice. Perhaps choice text will be limited or wraparounds can be generated based on typical browser dimensions.

Conclusion: It is possible to create a transparent "variable application" build outside of infinite-story that will appear as if it is hosted on infinite-story. There are kinks be the design but it is fairly straight forward. Given that Sev will not add this feature to I-S, it can be added from a separate host.

[apotheosis]

Alright, that's it. I'm just going to have to ask Sev how big of a donation he would want to add the feature in.... as soon as the economy turns around.

[Ryan_DuBois]

Don't get me wrong -- it's not that I don't believe the bit about other sites becoming infested with tons of "games"; I just happen to agree with apoth, in that it seems we've already established a pretty solid CYOA core on this website. I think the movement toward "games" would take a long time.

And I also don't really care about what type of stories are "dominant" on this webstie, as long as they're quality stories.

But I just know a lot of other members (including sev) probably do.

And, like you said, the website's free anyways.



I'm happy.

[Usoki]

Except that any "CYOA" website with the variable feature has ass-tons of games, and even fewer actual stories. You wouldn't think so, but there it is. I know exactly WHY we don't have the feature- I'd just like to have it. Half wishful thinking, and half "Well, dammit, I wouldn't abuse it. Stupid people are why we can't have nice things."

And, Drag, as far as your...how did you put it...clout? I meant nothing more than that, if Sev is going to listen to one person in a minority, it'd be you above all others. Yes, it's Sev's opinion in the end, but seniority does matter. A bit. Not too much- we're still a dictatorship, not some freakish oligarchy.

I mean, I can't complain too much- the site's free. If I don't like it, I have no justifiable reason to throw a bitch fit. I lose, I shrug, I roll with it.

[Ryan_DuBois]

I can see the point.

...But it's not as if we don't have people abusing the features on the site, as it is. I'd peg the percentage of quality stories at about 20% or less. I really don't think this "variable feature" would make things much worse than they already are.

Though this website is clearly oriented around well-written interactive stories, I don't think that allowing "game-like" works would really destroy the CYOA focus, either; they could simply be viewed as a different type of CYOA. People already have the freedom to write linear stories, which are much further from the CYOA format than gamebooks or "puzzle stories".

Dragavan is right though -- sev is the one who runs things around here... I just wanted to toss in my opinion. For the record, I doubt the story I'm working on will be finished, although I might try to turn what I've got into a much simpler "escape the room" type game.

[Dragavan]

I love that I don't even have to speak on the subject any more.

The absence of it keeps the focus of this place as being a STORY site and not a GAME site, as many of those that use that feature really are treated as. Nonetheless, we still have some people here who try to treat the format here as a game anyway and this feature would only increase their numbers.

As for my so called clout here, I never asked for it or even wanted it. I simply speak my mind and voice my personal opinion, especially on subjects I feel strongly about. It all really comes down to what Sev says. It is his site and even if we all disagreed with him on something it would still be his place to say otherwise. It just happens that he and I (and several others) actually agree on this one.

[donteatpoop]

Having been to a few sites with variable options, I have to agree with the "no way in hell" ruling.

I agree that we have a solid group here, and thaat people aren't going to be coming by in buses to use a new feature. Idiots already come to the site, most of them move on to other sites with this feature. I feel that the absense of variables is like an idiot repellant.

[Usoki]

Personally, I agree with you, Apoth- but I'm expressing Drag's opinion. And unless everyone vehemently disagrees with him, his weight with Sev wins out. Silly "Veteran member by several years" status. XD

[apotheosis]

I don't think the variable feature would detract from the site as much as you build it up to. We have a pretty solid community at this point, I doubt it would suddenly become infested if a convenient feature was added.

[Usoki]

Yeah, this site was not really built for that kind of story. It's doable...it's just obnoxious. It would be nice to have a variable function for choices- half of Rentyre's length comes from identical rooms cloned to accomodate different story choices. Different choices, different endings...duplicated middle. And that's only one variable. Get into stories like what you're talking about...

But, it's been discussed before, with one overwhelming conclusion- this is primarily a writing site, not a game site. The story comes first. Put in a variable feature, and it would get abused so fast... There are other sites with a variable feature. They also have an average literacy rate of a diseased monkey.

You know, if the barrel was a website, and the disease was Ebola...that'd explain End's sig rather well. How inadvertantly profound.

[Ryan_DuBois]

Well, you were right, DEP; it's a lot of work. I've got about 30 rooms so far... and I'm only about 60% of the way done with the first bedroom!

Giving the player the option of whether or not to pick up items is not the way to go.

And as of right now, I'm pretty sure I'll scrap the whole "combat items" thing. Essentially it would just force me to re-create the story (not just tiny parts of the story, but the whole thing) with miniature tweaks... unless I forced the player to pick up specific combat items and specific places where they have to go in order to advance.

Or I could get rid of the "backtracking" element.

I don't know.